I have to say that watching Eve Online is a fascinating thing, especially in matters that pertain to its economy. For those players unfamiliar with Eve it has one of the most expansive, in depth, and complex economies of any MMORPG to date. Recently CCP hired an actual certified economist to work full time as the economic overseer of Eve.
This new developer blog is a must read as it shows some information that is nothing less than head turning. Since no preformed methdology exists for how to go about studying these things in their particulars or how to write about them, it is interesting to see how CCP games is crossing the threshold into this new realm of understanding virtual worlds.
I found this part particularly interesting:
Total trade in minerals amounted to 1.6 trillion ISK (1600 billion ISK) on a weekly basis at the end of June 2007. That was a nearly 100% increase in weekly trade value compared to end of June 2006 and almost an eight-fold increase from June 2005. At the same time the population in EVE grew by 36%. Hence, trade in minerals is increasing at a higher rate than population itself. The faster increase in mining trade value is an indicator which shows that not only is the population of EVE rising but also that economic activity within EVE is rising. Trade volume increased at a slightly higher pace than trade value. The graph below shows that weekly trade volume increased from 10 billion units in 2003 to 120 billion units at the end of June 2006, or a twelve-fold increase. This increase is about 1.29% increase on a weekly basis, compared to an increase of 0.9% in total trade value. In order to examine the mineral market in more details and for further analysis in the future, it is useful to distinguish between high-end and low end minerals. High-end minerals can be mined in low sec and zero-zero space only but low end minerals can be mined in all regions, including Empire Space.
The low end minerals are tritanium, isogen, mexallon and pyerite. The high end minerals are megacyte, morphite, nocxium and zydrine.
Just keep scrolling down the page and the guy has LOADS of information and details about Eve's economy. Even if economics don't interest you as much as they do me, you can at least respect the complexity that virtual worlds are reaching as well as the invaluable data to be gained by respecting an academic touch in our MMORPG's.
Since the announcement of World of Warcraft’s second expansion, I would like to take this time to discuss some of the rumors and alleged features that the new expansion will bring.
The expansion is Northrend, etc, etc.
We will fight Arthas himself.
Level cap is 80 (New skills, new talents, etc)
The expansion is designed for lvl 68 and higher players.
The Death Knight class will be available for both alliance and horde players and it seems to work on the same mechanics as Jedi in SWG, you can create them once certain criteria are met. (First hero class of the game)
The Death Knight will combine damage dealing and tanking.
Siege weapons and destructible buildings will be added to PvP
A new battleground will be available
New profession : Inscription. (allows the player to permanently enhance their spells and abilities and to create mysterious items of power to use, trade, and sell.)
More hero classes will be added in the future
Leveling from 70 to 80 should took nearly the same time as 60 to 70 (probably a bit more)
First zone will be Howling Fjord
We should have roughly the same amount of dungeons as BC
I want to point out a couple of very interesting aspects that this new expansion is said to bring to World of Warcraft. First, let me remind you that this is only hearsay thus far (some things have been confirmed).
It is said that the new expansion will bring about destructible buildings into PvP. My first reaction is that of joy that finally the developers understand that asset destruction can play a large role in boosting conflict and there seems to be some semblance of risk and reward. However, my heart tells me that there will be no risk and reward. I am not a betting man but if I had to bet, my bet would lie in the fact that this asset destruction will be a temporary thing in which no true risk for reward happens. I would bet that these destructible buildings will respawn and carry no penalty for the side whose assets are destroyed. I assume that there will be no cost to building these assets, thus no risk is involved.
This expansion seems to be another grind for new levels, new items and a new class. It shocked me that blizzard would release a new expansion when over half of their population has not completed even 50% of the content in the previous one. It bothers me that Blizzard is confusing innovation with creation.
This is a great piece done on CNN international which represents forward thinking in the media (for a change) toward games. If you are tired of watching every local news report involving some juvenile delinquent throwing stuff at his parents and screaming at them about computer time (after mother says in an interview that he abandoned all of his friends and doesn't go outside anymore) then you should definitely check this out. There is no Mountain Dew comments or overweight stereotypes here....just an intriguing look at the development of virtual worlds in our society.
I want to personally thank CNN for doing this report as it is a big step forward for them in breaking through some of the incredibly thick media bias toward gaming right now. I also want to let you know that we are looking forward to an upcoming podcast interview with Dr. Nick Yee who recently finished his PhD at Stanford University in Virtual World studies. He has some great insight to offer about the psychology of virtual worlds. You may recognize his work on the Deadalus project website which specializes in gamer psychology in MMORPG's.
I hear a lot of guilds speaking lately about the “next game.” The PvP community is seemingly anticipating the arrival of the holy grail of games, whether it be Darkfall or Age of Conan or something that none of us know about yet we still cling to the concept of the next game. The million dollar question is not what game will it be, but when?
When will the next game come out that embodies skillful players fighting other players with a risk and reward system? When will the next game come out that will have guilds fight for their cities and houses and wealth? Are we stuck waiting on something that no one wants to develop?
To many times I hear guilds speak about the glory days of a game like UO or Shadowbane talking about what was as we all sit and wait for a game that might never be. Darkfall has been in development for 5 years now and like many of you everyday I check the forums to see if today is the day that beta opens. We all want a challenge in a game and endless raiding to us is not the challenge. This leaves us with a dilemma, do we succumb to fad and bite the bullet and play what is out now or do we troll forums and tough it out awaiting the next PvP game?
“In a time where every new MMO that’s not named “World of Warcraft” has struggled, it’s kind of heartening to see that Original Gangsta EQ is releasing an expansion pack, which includes the usual new levels, new race, and expansion of the level cap.
The most interesting line of the press release to me, though, is this one.
Content for Levels 1 to 75: Play through every level of the game without ever leaving the Serpent Spine Mountains.
At first glance, this would appear to be a mistake, and I couldn’t figure out why they took this tactic. I’ve mentioned before, one of the key parts of WoW’s success was it’s pattern breaking - the quests are rewarding enough to actively encourage you to explore the world and see new things. By contrast, EQ sounds almost proud that they’d be able to keep you in one small corner of the world. It seems dissonant. Especially when you consider that EQ has nearly 10 years of expansion pack content built up.
The fiancee pointed out where I was wrong, though. EQ is trying to sell the game to a whole bunch of people who have already gone through the earlier content, and is trying to lure them back. These people are probably like me, in that their lives would be better if they never had to see Cazic Thule again. Come to think about it, I feel kind of the same way about Dun Morogh in WoW.
But then there’s a subtler message here, too. One problem with EQ is that, while there is still a sizable community playing the game, virtually all of those players are maxed out and raiding with guilds. My attempts to play EQ in the last five years have been in empty newbie zones, on servers where I had a co-worker telling me they had hundreds of players raiding at the high levels on a given night in a tense guild political situation. And when you find yourself alone in a “massively multiplayer” game, you can’t escape the sledgehammer-like irony.
This press release basically implies something important: players who buy the expansion pack and start new characters (at least of the new race) will all be in the same place, so you won’t be lonely."
There are some really good points in this blog that I wanted to highlight.
1) What does a game do to keep people interested?
2) The grind mentality comes up again because no one wants to go through the same thing time and time and produce the same results, I believe that is classified as insanity.
3) How does PvP fit into this picture? PvP can become redundant if its result is always predetermined, and example of this would be cookie cutter classes with no real balance.
Player Goty from the Darkfall community has written a blog about his impressions of Eve Online. He strikes up some very good points that are very pertinent to players like us everywhere. I too have found it tough to get over some of the more monotonous aspects of Eve, but find myself infinitely intrigued by its rich game world and the fact that I have a passionate belief in player driven worlds. But without further ado here it is. I hope we can hear more from Goty in the future. Enjoy.
-Lindorn
The Problem with Eve Online
During this time of MMO stagnancy, we're bombarded with a constantly bubbling cauldron filled with all the Bats Eyes and Newt Intestines we've come to lovingly know as "EQ Clones." The Golden Age of MMO Gaming as we knew it ended long before the MMO Genre truly even began, and has now established itself as more than a niche market under the banner of safety, hand holding, and ass-grabbery which culminated with the commercial explosion known as WoW.
With the MMO world largely homogenized and pasteurized with the most vanilla of ingredients, we see a few MMO's that represent a stand against the normalcy of consensus and predefined construct, including WW2 Online, Shadowbane, Eve Online, and a few others that have barely scratched the surface of the market as a whole. Of these, only one truly survives and grows. It is the one which promises a world of unmatched intesnity, brutality, and freedom. One where the construct itself is built around the players imaginations. You truly create the content of this world which has been provided to you.
Eve Online.
Eve Online promises a literal universe to explore, to conquer, and to civilize. There are no pre-defined classes or treadmills to climb. You can make your fortune trading in goods from one end of the universe to the other, never lifting your finger to harm another. If a life of peaceful travel sounds as exciting as a sharp blade to the temple, you can also outfit your ship with all the necessary equipment to live a life of piracy, scanning systems for potential space-pinatas for you to whack into submission. Another option is to hunt these pirates and pad your wallet with the blood of those who oppress the weak.
The point is, this should be the MMO to change it all. The game we all clamor behind, cheering it on like so many hot cheerleaders in mini-skirts and pom poms (if only we weren't all so hairy and masculine). Instead, the opinions on the game are generally polar in nature - a true "love it" or "hate it" experience. Completely open gameplay, PvP, Loot, Territory control and player-owned Space Stations, an economic model complex enough to cause any Jewish Banker to break a sweat - but there's one huge problem to make it all seem worthless.
Eve is boring as hell.
All the beautiful screenshots and incredible trailers do not change the fact that Eve is as lonely, cold, and empty as the space it portrays - especially for the newcomers.
I try to love Eve, as all the Eve Community does, and have routinely subscribed (and subsequently quit) more times than I can remember. The first time I played Eve was sometime in 2004. I got drawn back into it this weekend (for the hundredth time) through an email with a free 5-day pass - and am considering giving it yet another real go.
The reason I keep trying, regardless of the boredom, is because I feel the solution to this problem is just a step away. I feel that reaching a state of "not boredom" is just a few weeks away. That is because the excitement in Eve comes from its 0.0/Corporation Gameplay. Finding a great corp and blasting around 0.0 space, deeply entrenched in the politics and battles between Alliances over who gets what slice of pie are all the aspects the Eve Vets rant and rave about.
Easier said than done - getting admission into any of the great Corporations will cost you months and months of Skill Training just to reach the bare minimum requirements they've placed to weed out the weak and inexperienced. At the same time, gaining admission into a startup corporation is as risky as ever, due to the high rate of new-corporation dissolution. Instead, your main hope is finding a corporation that takes on anyone - and you'll simply be faced with a large group of strangers who will generally have little interest in interacting with each other. The offers of free ships, isk, and skill books lure in less of the good element and more of the "I'm just in it for the snacks" types.
Another option is to befriend someone from an established corporation who might be willing to vouche for you - however, that is also a bit more difficult than the average MMO, since you will rarely be playing in the physical presence of other ships - most of the time, you're floating around alone in space. You'll find other players in transit, or hunting, or mining - but generally, striking conversation with them leads nowhere. Eve is about as lonely as a single-player space sim - with an online chat.
In the end, what we're faced with is a very thin line. It is the fine line the seperates Monotony from Freedom. Eve offers what could be the richest, deepest gameplay available from any MMO I've ever seen; and through its slew of minor problems and questionable systems, including its time-based skill gain and click-based controls; there is hope. The trick lies in making it along that thin line and making it to all the things that make Eve great. The bigger problem is that it is far too time consuming - and difficult - and reach past the boredom and reach that level we read about so often from Eve Online articles and stories from Teth. An MMO shouldn't take so much effort just to have fun with it.
As for me, I'll be playing Eve once again. There just aren't any mmo's worth playing anymore - and while that's not a good reason to pick up a game that just hasn't been fun, the potential to get in on the fun you keep hearing about is.
Why is it that we view the time it takes to level up a character as such a horrible thing that we export this job to over sea’s workers? (Note the political correctness) I will tell you why, END GAME. No one wants to take months to hit the end game and the only reason we even consider tolerating it is the benefits. In this writers case the benefit would be PvP. For instance, Shadowbane has the fasting leveling bar none of any MMO that I have played, still when you roll your 5th character you are not thinking, “ I will take this nice and slow,” you are thinking how can I box more accounts to hit 75 the quickest.
This is because basically, Shadowbane decided they would make the PvE so dull that no one will want to play it. Ok, that was sarcasm but the fact of the matter is that they over looked what PvE can do for players. Yes, you read that right, PvE CAN do something for players; it teaches them the ways their character reacts to situations. They learn the world the dev’s created, they learn the parameters in which their character can and cannot operate. Shadowbane’s end game is not instance raids or battleground because simply the world is a battleground.
Let us take World of Warcraft seeing it is the immovable object in the market right now. Anyone who has played WoW for any length of time knows that its grind, while not as bad as Everquest is daunting and redundant. Given that slap to the proverbial ego of the giant, they still immersed players in an environment that has allowed them to not only understand their characters purpose but also learn the world around them.
The real question is where is the balance between worthless PvE of Shadowbane and the daunting grind of WoW? Is there a balance or should all games be skill based? Sure this opens Pandora’s Box but YOU are the one’s paying their bills so what do you think a good PvP based MMO should do about the “grind”?
We have gone over many of the factors and concepts involved in what many are now referring to as the "sandbox" type of game. Just to throw a quick definition it will suffice to say that a sandbox MMORPG or online game would be one in which the developers took more of a "hands off" approach to the in-game limitations enforced on the player community. This would ultimately lead to a player controlled politic, economy, and sense of ownership. Basically this concept is the underlying idea behind Revolution G and much of the discussion on the boards here.
I would like to spotlight briefly a blog written recently by player "Vajuras". Some of his points are spot on and I want to give credit to anyone that supports the ideas we support here. This will also add more proof into the proverbial pot that we are growing and we WILL take the industry by storm.
One thing I wanted to point out is the horrible bias we are dealing with from anyone involved in online media or game related media of any form. Read the blog first and then read the "foreword" by MMORPG.com's community manager here.
This is what we are dealing with folks. Labels and stereotypes; minsinformation and classifications. This is exactly the type of stuff we need to stand up against everywhere we go. Now you know why we call it Revolution G.
Here was the community manager's response. With respect to her I don't think it was her intention to get into labeling things or to create a stir and it is possible I jumped on it a little aggressively. However I still believe the concepts stated in the thread are important for everyone to understand.
Quote:
I don't think "niche" means it has to have a small playerbase; as I said in the article, if a "general", catch all MMO has 15% of the MMOer population, and a game that focuses on PVP has 90% of the PVPer population, I do believe those would balance out by niche I meant that it wasn't trying to appeal to everyone: EVE is not an "everyone" game and I don't think it's trying to be.
My response:
Quote:
Don't get me wrong I am not arguing the numbers here. My point was that to put labels on these things is really hurtful in this particular scenario and I believe it is crippling the development of gameplaying in general. When we label things and stereotype things we are indirectly creating a "stigma" for things that don't really need to be categorized to begin with. How many articles, blogs, or posts have been made on this site or other major gaming publications in the last 6 months regarding "casual players". The phrase "casual player" has been thrown around so much it could make a person sick with the gross misuse.
Now I am reading things like this article that tells a totally different story about who is purchasing and how large of an "impact" a casual gamer really has on the industry. My point is simply that we are entering a new era here. I don't think any of us can deny that we have been playing games for a long time now and we are set in our ways in a lot of respects. Unfortunately on a community wide scale, and especially when influenced by the mainstream gaming media, these collectivized ideas we have can stunt progress.
Consider that World of Warcraft is such a popular game because of the genre, smooth game mechanics, addictive item based progression, well known company, well known title, already huge market saturation, etc etc. Obviously one or all of these reasons may not be the ones that come to mind immediately for you but that isn't my point. I am saying also consider that the MMORPG playerbase world wide has in the last few years increased by a factor of one third or more per year. If a statistic like this is true (or even half true) then there is a significant portion of the gaming community that is new to the MMORPG concept or is currently playing their first MMORPG. (WoW in a lot of cases). Now what is more likely.....that every single person who plays WoW has found the game that appeals to their needs as a gamer 100%? Or is it more likely that a significant portion of the MMORPG population playing mainstream titles has literally no idea what is available out there and if they do may not even feel comfortable moving elsewhere because it is unknown territory.
I am a firm believer that if you do not have a developed idea of how game mechanics impact a virtual world then you more than likely cannot fully appreciate what a "sandbox" title would actually entail. It is my belief that the MMORPG community is growing and evolving in its knowledge and expectation. Also add the fact that there is an influx of FPS and strategy gamers that are infiltrating what was up until a few years ago an "old boys club" of people who had played the MMO genre since back in the EQ/UO/MUD days.
Overall I am again simply stating that to use the traditional titles and labels we have over the past 10 years is to stunt growth and close our minds to the possibilities in gaming today. It is exactly this sort of mentality that leads to the same type of games being produced over and over and over and over again. The mold is set in the public eye and we need to break it.....
I highly doubt CCP games designed Eve Online to appeal to a "special interest" crowd. On the contrary I think what they did was designed what they felt was the ultimate game and something that had really never been done before and if it so happened to draw a good amount of players in the process they'd be satisfied. I think they were way ahead of their time and the evidence in their rapidly rising subscriptions and multiple awards over the last 6 months represents this fact clearly.
The Associate Producer of Darkfall has stated that there won't be much of a need for widescale media/market saturation akin to mainstream titles for their game because the developers believe firmly that "the game will sell itself". That takes a hefty set of stones to make a comment like that as far as I'm concerned. Either they are insane and have no idea what they are doing....or they might just have the right idea about the future of gaming and have full confidence in its fruition.
Just some things to tickle your noggin. Thanks for the response Laura and again it is not my intention to call a stand off here. I just have very defined opinions about this kind of thing.
So to Vajuras, thanks.
PS: even though he hasn't responded to my PM's yet on MMORPG.com, I will entice him into a podcast just give me time .
World of Warcraft has changed the landscape of MMOs in so many ways. The question that is on my mind is, can the MMO industry produce games that are not like WoW and survive? Everything I have seen thus far suggests that Warhammer Online looks to be WoW 2.0. The only difference that I have seen is that Warhammer has listened to the players and decided to incorporate more PvP. Don’t get me wrong I am not bashing W.H.O; I am suggesting that in the grand scheme of things, what is the difference between W.H.O and W.O.W?
Even the look of the games strikes a major similarity!
There seems to be a distinct lack of innovation these days with MMOs. Blizzard opened the door an entire new generation of MMO players why would we shut the door by producing clones of WoW? Are publishers that afraid to take a chance that they tell their teams to produce a WoW-like experience?
Recently in the general discussion forum, Drekor started a thread entitled: What makes a good PvPer? I wanted to weigh in with my own ideas on what makes a good PvPer.
I believe that the number one aspect to being a good PvPer is knowledge. Without knowledge, you limit your ability to understand the game. The cliché is true knowledge is power. The more that you know and understand about a game the more you are able to strategize and come up with ideas that other players who are less knowledgeable would never imagine. Understanding the mechanics of the game allows players a deep understanding on why certain skills work the way they do. A player who engages in PvP without a deep understanding of the game he or she is playing limits their opportunity for success. If you do not know a skill works a certain way then you cannot take advantage of the attributes that skill has, therefore you limit your ability to succeed.
There are many more things that it takes to become a good PvPer however the most important aspect to achieving success on the battlefield is understanding the way the game works. You can be phenomenal at strategizing but without knowledge, your strategies are for nothing. Once the player understands the game than he or she can implement strategies that are effective in combat. Knowledge is essentially the gateway in which a player must pass to be a true competitor.
There is no doubt in my mind that the number one aspect to becoming a good PvPer is understanding the game in which you play. Once the player understands the mechanics of the game, you open up the vast variety of options available in which the player can then strategize and make split second decisions because they understand the game and its mechanics. Without this component, they are doomed to wander aimlessly never understanding the true aspects of the game. A true competitor studies everything that they can get their hands on. They know how every still works, they know the math behind the formula of how the skill works and most of all they know how to implement the skill in any given situation.
How this conceptual design would transpire is one that takes balance and thought. For instance you cannot have housing be something that takes months and months to obtain if you plan on adding the ability to destroy it as well. If you do this the risk of losing your assets is much greater then the reward of having it and thus people will not embrace the concept. One must provide a balance to the game and this is done by making the risk and reward on par. Having cities and structures that are able to be destroyed adds a strategic factor that many PvP games lack. It's wonderful to reward players, but if a player doesn’t have risk involved then they soon becomes jaded with their possessions and lose site of its value.
Asset destruction allows accountability to the player who seeks to use grief tactics to bully or berate players. What I mean by this is if a player from guild A is bullying lower players constantly and giving the guild a bad name then the player base can now go to the guild A's city or base of operations, and extract revenge for the shameless acts being perpetrated. If guild assets are on the line, the player representing the guild is much more aware that their actions have serious consequences. This accountability aspect allows players to settle conflicts in a manner that promotes warfare among guilds, rather then a small group of player engaging in ganking. It gives a base of operation to guilds and allows them to participate in regional conflicts by placing the center of the PvP on the guild rather then the individual. This allows alliances to be formed, politics and treaties to be made and most of all, it allows players to become involved in the guilds they are a part of.
Asset destruction must be balanced with the casual player in mind. Understanding how housing and city destruction will change the landscape and help balance power to conflicts is the first step in understand asset destruction. Player owned assets are not something that is solely for the PvP or PvE crowd. Player owned assets help bridge the gap of play styles and incorporates much more then PvP or PvE. It allows the player to have something they can call their own. It gives the player the chance to be the developer and use their creativity.
It is important to understand that new ideas like assets are something that must be tested and talked about among the entire MMO community. Having the ability to own a piece of property allows the player to open their creative minds to new and innovate ways to participate in the game and creates a sense of belonging to this massive world that exists. This concept has proven to be successful in other titles, such as “The Sims” and “Second Life”, and I believe will be a key concept in the next generation of MMOs.
Since the dawn of time civilizations have built structures to keep them safe from the elements and to express their culture. Whether it is to honor their beliefs in a place of worship or to have a place to call their own, buildings and monuments play a crucial role in the lives of billions of people.
The MMO industry is an industry that thrives off of new and innovative ideas. There are many games that have implemented player housing into their design concepts. Games like “Ultima Online” and “Shadowbane” are a few titles that have taken the ownership concept to another level. In Ultima Online, a player could purchase a house deed and then place their new house. Once a player placed his or her house, they could decorate it any way they wanted and even add vendors or merchants and open it to the public. In Shadowbane a player could create not only a house, but a city of their own design, with guards and merchants. Other games have scratched the surface of this concept as well. Games like “Everquest 2” have allowed player owned assets to be a part of the game.
Though these concepts have been implemented before, it seems to be something that has fallen by the wayside in current MMOs. The ability to own a piece of the world that you are immersed in is something that allows players to feel connected and makes them strive for new things to add to their possessions. The concept of player created homes and cities is but one piece of an ever growing opportunity to allow players to connect with the world that the developers have spent so much time in creating. (See the Revolution G poll)
I can't discuss the topic of player assets without talking about the exciting player-driven conflicts that could arise because of this sort of implementation. With every reward comes a risk. Player housing is a cutting edge idea. However, if you couple that concept with the ability to allow conflict in the mix, you can, with proper balance, create the risk aspect of PvP.
I have been thinking a lot lately about Revolution G and our goals as gamers and authors. I know that I want to bridge the gap between developer and gamer but I believe that the divide is larger than just that between the developer and gamer. I believe that the MMO industry is in a rut. World of Warcraft has given many publishers a false sense of how a game must be made in order to be successful. The more I speak with developers and gamers the more I realize that the divide is far too often the fault of the publisher rather then the developer.
This leads me to the harsh realization that the industry is suffering because the people writing the checks don’t play the games they are funding. Revolution G is an opportunity for gamers and developers to come together and strategize on the future of the industry. We are not a news site but a site that is devoted to concepts and ideas rather then just buying into the hype that many games incite. We have an opportunity to share ideas with each other in a manner that is respectful and promotes a positive force in the industry. Through the exchange of ideas we create a community that is essential in all facets of gaming.
When I think of the future of Revolution G, I see the community becoming a place where developers come to look for ideas and see the future of gaming. I see members building contacts and getting hired from companies who visit our site. I see networks and friendships being created through the common goal of competitive gaming.
Revolution G is finally alive and growing and it will take the devotion of a strong community to keep it that way. For those of you already contributing in various ways you have our undying gratitude. Without your help and input this cannot and would not be possible. We are so excited as players and writers to bring you some of the things to come. We have developers and writers on the horn 24/7 to contribute to what we are doing here, and so far the response to everything we have done is nothing less than the pinnacle of enthusiasm.
For me this is like living a fantasy that I have been looking for over the past 5 years. I have imagined a new kind of virtual world and I want to work with this community to give it a face and a heart. I want to push this industry to support an unprecedented level of immersion and interaction in their games. I want a game without stringent limitations and spoon fed content where the only limits are our own imaginations. I want a game where you and I will make the story. Trust me when I say that we as players can do a better job at making an exciting story than any developer could simply through our own social dynamic. It isn't about any inherent talent that the players have, it is just the natural progression of human interaction.
Our immediate goals for the site are to open the lines of communication with the current community and continually expand it as well. The plan for our podcast is on a weekly schedule and we will be incorporating as much of your input as possible from the sound off sections.
I want us to start working together to have publications where we discuss and draw our design concepts into comprehensive guides that can be readily available for developers and other gamers.
We will also be working on an "enlighten your peer" section that anyone who wants to spread these ideas can use as a reference. It will have a compilation of several articles and concepts that we feel are the "base of the pyramid" of the goals of Revolution G.
What we need from you guys the most though is saturation. Any time you can link, us, plug us, or even just tell a friend about us it will result in a better community here. Again thank you for all of your support and I hope you are all prepared for a true Revolution.
I want to point out one question that Warcry asked:
Quote:
WarCry: The market is looking crowded for potential PvP MMOs. With Warhammer, Age of Conan and others on deck, how do you hope to set yourself apart?
Mike Madden, Creative Director: We are going to give players excitement and thrills they've never experienced in the MMO space. Its one thing to call something a PvP game, and another to deliver a War-like experience. That is the larger aspect of how we will separate ourselves. We will re-introduce the Massively Multiplayer back into MMO. We want to give a varying range of group-size experiences. We want large battles, PVE or PVP. We want players to experience the benefit and struggles of banding together large groups of players, building empires and civilizations, in a game world where their activity has palpable results. To put it in the term we use: "A Player Driven World"
Mr Madden,
You sir are THE MAN! This is what Revolution G has been talking about when we use phrases like dynamic worlds, player driven content and conflict driven concepts. Warhammer and Age of Conan are setting up the playing field for the next generation of successful MMOs, from what Mike Madden said today, SBG is creating it. Apparently someone is listening to the community when we discuss ideas about dynamic worlds and creating environments that spawn war-like experiences. We want to challenge our skills in a system that is built on the foundation of risk and reward. We want to create nations and dive into conflicts.
The fact that the creative director of SBG would use phrases like, “Player Driven World” and “re-introduce the Massively Multiplayer back into MMO,” gives all players a hope for something new and something that many of us have been waiting for, a challenge. Today the last word goes to Mike Madden so Age of Conan, Warhammer online and anyone else who claims their game is a PvP game, listen up!
Its one thing to call something a PvP game, and another to deliver a War-like experience.
This patch should be called BC done right. Blizzard has released content at a pace that is staggering! Props to them for developing this stuff so quickly but the pattern they seems to follow is that of releasing content well before it is ready. Anyone who has stepped foot in Serpent Shrine Cavern before the patch knows exactly what I mean. There was more trash in there then the NYC landfill. In the latest patch we see all epics getting some much deserved love. Sure there is yet more PvE content in the Black Temple and more reputation grinds in the Netherwing faction but this patch gave raiding a kick and a kiss.
Potions are much less money but do less however this is counter balanced by the great buff all epics have received. My biggest question is with gear that gives you +32 to Stam, Agi, Str and all these attributes where does blizzard go next? By the next expansion will they have gear that is +130 to stam +154 to str and we all walk around with 100K life?
Let’s face it, we all know that World of Warcraft is not a PvP game and their aspects of PvP are limited and toxic at times. We don’t log in WoW expecting a riveting PvP battle we log in expecting stable servers. With the implementation of patch 2.1 we saw an upgrade in hardware again that took the servers down for 12+ hours. Most people bitched up a storm but the people bitching probably don’t have that much MMO experience. I can clearly remember MMO patch days where the game wouldn’t come back up. Blizzard has set a mark in quality programming that must be respected by all members of the industry.
With a patch this big there are bound to be several issues that must be looked into and we all know that currently there are. However, with this patch the games balance from a PvE standpoint has gotten closer to the area where it should have been before the expansion was launched. After the dust clears and players update their addons I am sure we will see more encounters being beaten and more epics handed out.
People don't understand one very simple common sense issue in regard to full loot.
If you implement full loot into a game with open PvP then it is only a matter of time until you die.....no matter who you are...right? Hell you could go afk for 5 minutes and get ganked and come back to no gear. So chances are eventually it is going to happen. OK I'm glad we deduced that.
So you can die at any moment. No matter how you look at it this effectively makes gear worthless. If you become naked after every time you die then basically the gear is worth nothing. If the gear was "uber" then it would be passing hands faster than a hot potato because hell even if your guildee had uber gear technically you could gank his ass and take it for yourself! The importance of gear and the given loot rules ARE NOT MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE. I dont know why people have such a hard time getting this point.
The gear in such a game will help you, but the way I imagine it will HAVE to be in order for the game to operate correctly is that armor and weapons will be mass produced by guild craftsman. As in the guild armory will be open for anyone who needs it and will contain many suits of armor and equipment for those that need to resupply and head back out. Gear will be a generic collection of items that will be more indicative of how powerful an individual guild is rather than how good at finding "phat loots" any given player is.
The thing I love about full loot isn't because I get off on the idea of some dude ganking me and looting me blind. If you think that potential PvPers like the system because its "omg so h4rdc0r3", then you just cant see anything but the superficial. The reason we like full loot is because if a full loot system is implemented it literally guarantees that the gear will not be the deciding factor in PvP battles.
Jim You are About to be Owned (with all due respect)
Lately the phrase “It can’t be done” has been a part of my exchanges with other gamers and those with development experience when considering a game world with dynamic elements. I am so sick of reading forums where people laugh at Shadowbane and use it as an ace up their sleeve to convince people that open PvP doesn’t work. Even more disgusting is that many of these people will give grudging credit to EvE as if somehow EvE is less hardcore (it is arguably MORE in some ways) than Shadowbane was just because the game is booming right now and they don’t have a damn thing to say about it.
Even among those with prior experience in such a gaming environment or those that advocated PvP and a “hands off” developer approach in regard to stringent rules, there still seems to be this ever developing stigma of lost hope and failure. Yet when I talk to other gamers about PvP driven games, dynamic worlds, or an immersive political and economic system it incites such a positive response. “Can it really be done?” they ask me. I think it can be and I think the iron is hot for change in online gaming.
For those of us who look forward to this change and embrace these concepts we cannot lose hope lest we hamper our own efforts. I have spent much of my time and effort staying in tune with the thoughts and desires of a large portion of the gaming community. There is so much propaganda out there about PvP and “open worlds” that really takes a significant role in ostracizing many players from the mainstream. A bunch of counterstrike junkies that invaded peaceful “RPG land” and stole the heart right out of its chest; thats what those dirty PvPers are!
This demonization is counterintuitive, counterproductive, and really slows the development of the concepts and implementation behind our gamer philosophy. There is a reason the Shadowbane community to this day remains in close proximity even though many of its parts wander aimlessly in the gaming world. There is also a reason that EvE online has seen an influx of subscribers and won a bundle of awards this year. Until recently EvE received very little attention for its monumental accomplishments as an RPG and it's success is a testament to how in depth and immersive a dynamic economy and political system can be.
If this is all about griefing and ganking then why has it been so hard for these folks to find new games to play? There is always a noob to gank in Ashenvale or an FFA server to play on in Vanguard. How does the anti PvP disgruntled X-Everquest junkie explain that? The truth is we are seeing a new breed of PvPer. One that relishes a purpose behind the player conflict. Why are Warhammer and AoC two of the most anticipated games in development right now? Is it just PvP? If it was just PvP then we’d all be doing Alterac valley every day or be playing Unreal tournament. Clearly we as PvPers want more from our games.
We want cities, regional conflicts, territory control, politics, intrigue. Is it really that hard to grasp that the PvP and open world concept is what all of these players (and there are a lot of us) are looking for? Our communities in Ultima Online, Shadowbane, and EvE have been the artisans of the most intriguing content ever before seen in an online world. I was speaking to one of the community managers from Shadowbane recently and she mentioned how easily she could connect with individuals in the community and how in many ways it seemed more personal. Hey “Jim” the PvP critic…..is that evidence indicative of a hostile community full of griefers? Sure there was a lot of vitriol no doubt about it, but at the end of the day the community had a bond unlike any other.
This is where I turn it around and have a little talk with our buddy “Jim the carebear” and spell out my own logical conclusion here:
I’ve got a few words for you Jim. You don’t think before you open your mouth Jim. I have a problem with you making it a point to ostracize a community Jim. I know you feel it is your responsibility to protect your beloved MMORPG from corruption. But the truth of the matter is you just can’t handle change Jim. You know what? That’s ok. All I ask is that you shut it for a while and do some research allright Jim? I know that the term “carebear” is a blanket term that doesn’t apply to everyone who doesn’t like PvP Jim, but you are the reason the term was coined.
You are the perfect example of the intolerant traditionalist. You really are a carebear Jim. You are not a true gamer in my opinion Jim. Somewhere along the way you forgot what that meant Jim. You are being phased out Jim and I’ll be here to watch you kick and scream. It’s ok to have an opinion or a style Jim. But don’t look to wage a crusade, because I’ll wage total war. I know falling off the radar is painful Jim, but try to hang in there. I know there are a lot of stereotypes flying around, but you know who you are and you know you are on a vendetta. Give it up Jim, honestly you just won’t win. Change is coming, and there is nothing you can do.
So, here it is. This is the content that you've been hopefully waiting for and that which the authors wish to respectfully deliver to you. Revolution G is intended to be just that; a revolution for gamers. The writers here hold fast to a core philosophy and belief about gaming, about customer service, and about the mentality behind concepts such as competition. There is an apparent lack of content that touches on these ideals in a no BS manner with no punches pulled. We are here to express our opinions on game design, gaming philosophy, and the direction of the industry and art of gaming in general. It is our goal to remedy what we feel is a situation in which gamers are spoon fed games one after the other that cater to a business plan before they cater to us. We think it's time we remind the "execs" who pays their paychecks. But it isn't just about a guy in a suit. This is also about us. Aided by the influence of gaming companies that wish to pacify us long enough to get our next monthly subscription, the online gaming world is losing its sense of sportsmanship and competition.
As our games become more immersive we as players have become more gripped by greed and monotonous progression. We pay people somewhere behind a desk for the "privilege" to toil for long hours in order to achieve some deceptive and fleeting reward, effectively letting them walk away without accountability for the content of the game or lack thereof. What about the improvement? What about the education? What about the lessons learned and the competition.
We live in a world where competition is hush hush because we don't want to hurt anyone's feelings. What happened to us? Are we going to let ourselves or an industry sully our idea of what a true game should be, or are we going to stand up and change this industry and our own flawed mentality in the process?
We are here to battle the scrub, we are here to battle item-based games, we are here to battle a grind that attempts to replace real content, and we are here to fight for the true concept of a game. We are the Bill O'Reilly of the gaming world. We are not here to make friends. We are here to aid the discouraged gamer that desperately seeks to feel as if the 50 dollar set of CD's he purchased for the next "hot game" wasn't pissed away.
Guilds are nothing more than symbiotic relationships in WoW. "I need you, you need me, lets hook up". If that necessity is removed the guild itself collapses. The examples of this are all around you if you have been playing the game over the last 3 years. So while many argue that BC was a "guild killer", I say WoW doesn't even create true guilds to kill in the first place. I know a lot of first time MMOG'ers like to believe their WoW guilds were innovative, "strong", or meaningful but the majority of the time they are just plain wrong. In order to create a lasting guild it has to be built on solid principles, as it will be those principles that carry you through the "lean" times. The lean times WILL come....there will be a time when there is no game to play, or when activity is low, and these type of things will see a WoW guild dissolve in seconds.
A true guild is built in an environment where it is a necessity that each player contributes his/her talents and skills for the good of the whole and where it is of the utmost importance that each person has integrity, loyalty, good communication skills, and resilience. A dynamic world featuring open player versus player content necessitates these concepts and therefore creates long lasting guilds.
No WoW player that has been victim of this kind of thing should feel as if they have failed at all, for even the strongest guilds are being torn asunder all over in World of Warcraft. Guilds with 8 year running streaks going back to Ultima Online, Shadowbane, DaoC, Meridian 59, and EQ have been torn apart by the greed driven game mechanics of WoW. The game is quite simply solely based upon the acquisition of materials for one's own character. The entire game is one long episode of "pimp my character", except here you dont even get to shake hands with Ludacris. WoW is like a virus that just poisons people's motivation....it is really sickening to see how people and organizations change under the influence of the greed and self satisfying nature of the game.
by niche I meant that it wasn't trying to appeal to everyone: EVE is not an "everyone" game and I don't think it's trying to be.
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